Dealing with Anti-scientific Buffoons

I can't believe some of the anti-science crap floating around YouTube. No sooner than you flush some of the excrement out of a forum you're frequenting then some more gets dumped in. What's an honest skeptic to do?

The HomeoTards Past

Mr. Benneth hasn't shown his face in the YouTube forums since the skeptics there spanked him pretty hard over his dishonesty. For now he's sulking and firing potshots from his personal blog.

Mr. Bonking still makes an appearance, mainly to preform a "drive-by" spamming and rarely engages in conversation anymore. Sometimes he'll attempt his Homeopathy apologetics as drhomeopathycures, but even that's weak and infrequent.

The HomeoTards Present

One Homeopath I deal with is only 16 years of age. Old enough to be held accountable, but young enough I still hold out some hope for his eventual return to reality. At this point I'd rather not consider him a HomeoTard, but if the evidence suggests otherwise I may have to change my mind.

This brings me to the main subject of this post, RebornHammer. This "gentleman" (a term I use here, but loosely) came into the forums making claims that James "The Amaz!ing" Randi" had defrauded one Vithoulkas on the $1M Challenge.

A little research into the matter reveals the following:



After frequent attempts to get RebornHammer to provide some verifiable, peer-reviewed evidence fail, RebornHammer begins posting quotes from scientific laureates in an attempt to convince the skeptics that they're being irrational and unscientific. The skeptics of course understand these quotes and their meanings better than RebornHammer does. It also gets pointed out to reborn hammer that these quotes don't count as evidence in support of Homeopathy's supposed efficacy.

The upshot of this was that I finally lost my temper. Perhaps I was over the top, I don't know. Dealing with deniers of science and cranks all of the time makes me feel cranky. Anyhow, here's an excerpt of the conversation where I blow up.

RebornHammer:

Cancer is finally cured in Canada but Big Pharma has no interest, watch it 'till the end!

tinyurl com/25lz49u

regarding what it worthy of scientific study, WHERES THE MONEY?. what is worthy of being studied, please watch the YOUTUBE video titled : Cancer is finally cured in Canada but Big Pharma has no interest, watch it 'till the end!

wstevenschneider:

@RebornHammer How is this evidence of the efficacy of Homeopathy?

RebornHammer:

this is evidence of the inefficacy of the scientific community and the Pharmaceutical industry. There is little interest in cures and medicines that are not patentable. Homeopathic remedies are not patentable. So there would be no interest in proving their efficacy. How about you tell me something that is proven to work(peer review or whatever you think is worthy) that is not patentable? There will be few things you can tell me about. Of course I could be wrong but you go ahead and tell me.

wstevenschneider:

@RebornHammer The puerile pustulence that erupted from this particular post of yours demonstrates what passes for thought in that festering and malodorous mound that you call your brain. None of your technology that you enjoy so much has come about w/o science guiding it. From the car that you drive, to the device that plays your favourite music, to medicine that's protected you from illness, to the building that you live in.

None of these things would have come about without the science, the scientific community and the peer-review process which you so revile. If you dislike these things so much then please turn in your vehicle, give up your music player, stop taking medicine and move into a cave.

You argue against medicine when supporting homeopathy, but you want a "cure for cancer" that hasn't been all the way through trials yet.

In your arguments against science and medicine you try to have it both ways. You want science to approve of the things that you want, but you don't wish to let science take its course and discover how some cure really works, when it works and how well it works.

Now you conflate a possible medicine that may be used in the future with Homeopathy. DCA has much more effectiveness than any Homeopathic remedy so your sorry attempt to equate the plight of Homeopathy with DCA just marks you as desperate and pathetic.

Homeopathy has already been explored and found wanting. There's nothing new here; in-vitro tests on cancer cells with Homeopathic remedies weren't statistically more significant than the control and quality clinical trials have never shown that Homeopathy is more effective than placebo.

DCA: currently being researched and has efficacy beyond control

@RebornHammer In case you interpret this as an ad hominen note that I am criticizing your continued lack of understanding of how science works, how peer-review works and your insistence that we believe Homeopathy works despite its consistent failure to work in trials or lab tests.

Go and educate yourself on how science and peer-review works instead of concocting conspiracy theories. You're beginning to bore me.

murdocha (Ah, where were you earlier? :-)):

@RebornHammer What is your argument here? Big Pharma makes money so it is bad, therefore homeopathy works? I don't want to put words in your mouth, but that seems to be the essence of your argument. Please, make a request for the financial records of Boiron, Hahnemann Labs, Celletech, OHM Pharma (a Big company), see if they are making a profit. If they are, be prepared to judge them in the same light.

RebornHammer Claims about Cancer Cure
RebornHammer Claims Bad Science and I Blowup
My Blowup Continued

So yes, my head hurts from having to deal with these sorts of people on YouTube. Maybe I will take a break from YouTube for a couple of days, spend time with my wife and kids and get reconnected.

Mr. Bonking vs. Murdoch: Throwing Down the Gauntlet

Better Than Ultimate Fighting

Well, I never watch UFC fights, but I find this more interesting anyhow.

The Challenge

Murdoch, tired of Mr. Bonking's constant spamming and sniping in the James Randi explains homeopathy channel forum has issued a formal challenge to Mr. Bonking.

drchristoaa:

@murdocha YOU , JUST A BORN IDIOT , Dont have
the ability to think and answer, i feel pity
for you..

The TRUTH is your IQ is very LOW, AND you have
proved it with more and more evidence by your
posts here, and still going on proving it...
ass hole

murdocha:

@drchristoaa Actually, I believe I have shown,
in post after post, a logical, well thought out
argument. You, on the other hand, have resorted
to name calling, mass spamming, voting a number
of posts as spam when they are not, and fake
accounts to prop up your beliefs, while providing
no robust evidence for homeopathy.

drchristoaa:

@murdocha TOTALLY WRONG COMMENT

murdocha:

@drchristoaa I issue you a formal challenge.
Please present your most logical and cogent case
for homeopathy from the posts on this video. No
trolling, no all-caps, no marking spam, just your
best argument from those you have made to date. I
will reply to that with the most logical and
scientifically based of those I have posted on
this video.

If you don't (or can't), then I will consider the
argument closed.

Murdoch challenging Mr. Bonking

Mr. Bonking's Current Response

Mr. Bonking's response thus far has been to ignore the challenge and continues his spamming program.

drchristoaa:

HOMEOPATHY IS THE MOST ADVANCED SCIENCE OF
HEALING...SCIENCE HAS ALREADY PROVED HOW HOMEOPATHY
WORKS...DEAR FRIENDS PLEASE UP DATE YOUR SCIENCE
KNOWLEDGE....HOMEOPATHY IS THE MEDICNE OF FUTURE,
EVEN THE FATHER OF MODERN MEDICNE SUPPORTED
HOMEOPATHY.

This video is published by antihomeopaths, because
many poeple are tuning to homeopathy for better health,
SO IGNORE THIS FOOLSIH VIDEO.

HOMEOPATHY WORKS...EXPERIENCE IT.

Blech! Spam!

Where Now?

Until Mr. Bonking actually takes up Murdoch's challenge he will not be able to prove his case. However, I believe I can predict how this will go:

1. Mr. Bonking will yet again present the IIT Bombay study as evidence for efficacy of Homepathy.
2. Murdoch will refute IIT Bombay study yet again.
3. Mr. Bonking will claim, "Nuh huh!" and proceed to spam the forum.
4. The rest of us will document and publish the idiocy of Mr. Bonking's arguments and behaviour.

Bear in mind, I've been wrong before. Mr. Bonking may rise to the challenge. Although the science is settled,there's always that small chance that scientists got things wrong, however improbable that may be.

There's also the small chance that Mr. Bonking, should he fail at providing verifiable, peer-reviewed evidence for his claims, will bow out graciously. Small, but possible.